Student looking for re-readers for his thesis ( it deals with embedded system, USB, Linux, microcontrolers, firmwares ... )

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

I have released the first full version of my thesis. I am looking for
rereaders to track syntax and phrasing problems.

The reader is expected to try to understand what I wrote, and report any
problem.

The subject is (50k)
http://www.demaine.info/projet_self_tracking_webcam/project_proposal.pdf

the log book is (4M)
http://www.demaine.info/projet_self_tracking_webcam/log_book.pdf

the Thesis is (7M)
http://www.demaine.info/projet_self_tracking_webcam/formal_report.pdf

The root url is http://www.demaine.info/projet_self_tracking_webcam/

If any one hates PDF, you can download the Latex sources at
http://www.demaine.info/projet_self_tracking_webcam/reports/
:)

***
Readers shall only report about the FormalReport, but might want to read
the project proposal first ( just 2 pages ).
***

In short. it deals with building a camera able to track any object. I
had to build a USB development board based on the motorola MC68HC908JB8,
write the monitor to upload the firmware under Linux, write the
firmware, write the user application able to view the picture, compute
it, and give orders to the USB board to move the servo motors supporting
the camera.

All reports are written in english; all software are written to run on
Linux.

Readers shall send any comments at the email written in the front page,
or the one on Loading Image... .

I dont expect any one to understand it all, because it involves both low
level hardware, and hih level programming ... but if one guy can
criticize the low level and an other one the high level, that would be
great.

If after reading some pages any one still feel like reading it all,
pleas inform me about it by mail, so that I know how many readers will
do it, and how much time I shall wait for comments before printing it
for my teacher.

Like every one, I am in hurry; so please just mail me and tell me how
much time it will take to read it all.

PS : one part is still missing. It will say the same thing as the web
page, but in the PDF.

Many thanks for any help.
- --
DEMAINE Benoît-Pierre http:/www.demaine.info/
\_o< apt-get remove ispell >o_/
There're 10 types of people: those who can count in binary and those who
can't

[Chris Cole]

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 21:09:35 +0000, DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre wrote:

<snip freeloader>

And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers to
'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present *your*
thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid.
HTH
Chris.

[Randy Yates]

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers to
'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present *your*
thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid.
HTH
Chris.

Chris,

I think that's a very heavy-handed comment. If you're not interested, simply
don't respond. I think it's reasonable to ask the folks here for such help. Of
course many people won't have the time, but some might.

[Chris Cole]

Post by Randy Yates

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers
to 'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present
*your* thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid. HTH Chris.

Chris,
I think that's a very heavy-handed comment. If you're not interested,
simply don't respond. I think it's reasonable to ask the folks here for
such help. Of course many people won't have the time, but some might.

Randy,

I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested). However,
the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected people with a
high level of technical expertise to donate their free (not as in free
beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond what I consider
reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and phrasing problems'. He
doesn't need technical expertise, just a native English speaker.

The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

Remember, a thesis is supposed to be all your *own* work. Surely, he could
have got a friend or someone in the University dept. to have a look, esp.
as he's not specifically after technical pointers. Also, I don't
understand why he wants us to see before his supervisor. It's just as much
in his interest that you pass as it is yours, it's part of his supervisory
role to check the final report/thesis.
My comments may have been harsh, but I feel fair.

Chris.

[Randy Yates]

Post by Chris Cole
[...]
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

[Babacio]

Randy Yates.

Post by Randy Yates

Post by Chris Cole
[...]
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

I think you are totally right: this message sounds very arrogant.
However, the author is not a native english speaker, so that may be
clumsiness and not arrogance?

By the way, this post was a spam, it is crossposted in 8 groups
without any followup. It would be very nice of you to chose a single
group to persue this dicussion. Especially avoid fr.sci.maths which is
a french speaking group.

I position a first followup to all the english speaking groups, this
is still bad, but I really don't know which to chose.

[Chris Cole]

Post by Babacio
Randy Yates.

Post by Randy Yates

Post by Chris Cole
[...]
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

I think you are totally right: this message sounds very arrogant.
However, the author is not a native english speaker, so that may be
clumsiness and not arrogance?
By the way, this post was a spam, it is crossposted in 8 groups
without any followup. It would be very nice of you to chose a single
group to persue this dicussion. Especially avoid fr.sci.maths which is
a french speaking group.

Good point. I initially thought it was a relevant ng as he is probably
French (judging by the OPs name), but the report is written in English so
it is an irrelevant ng to post this 'request' to.

Post by Babacio
I position a first followup to all the english speaking groups, this
is still bad, but I really don't know which to chose.

[Chris Cole]

Post by Randy Yates

Post by Chris Cole
[...]
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

Yeah, it's the least they can do. I think it was this that touched a
nerve, originally.

As Babacio mentioned this is probably spam, so I guess I should have
ignored it after all.

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

Post by Randy Yates
That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

If I expected my english to be good, I would not look for re-readers.
I may be wrong for many things. That is right, even in the way I ask for
help.

[Chris Cole]

Post by Randy Yates
That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

If I expected my english to be good, I would not look for re-readers. I
may be wrong for many things. That is right, even in the way I ask for
help.

If you were only interested in correcting language errors you shouldn't
have posted to technical ngs (all *8* of them). BTW aren't proof-reading
facilities available at Staffs Uni. I know at my University there are
plenty of notices around campus from people prepared to proof-read and/or
type-up theses for non-native English speakers. If there are so many
foreigners at your place as you say, I would expect a lot of this going
on.

[A Nengineer]

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by Randy Yates
That bugs me too when I hear people phrase things like that. If they
expect a favor, the least they can do is phrase the request politely.

If I expected my english to be good, I would not look for re-readers.
I may be wrong for many things. That is right, even in the way I ask for
help.

The correct term in English is "proof-readers."

If I had the time to spare, I'd certainly help you out. I hope that
someone will comply.

FWIW, ten or fifteen years ago when newsgroups were predominantly
education and industry driven, no one would have thought twice about
your request.

Sorry that we have so many putzes around now that choose to believe that
THEIR agenda is the only reason that newsgroups still exist.

'Luck with your thesis.

[J***@physik.fu-berlin.de]

Post by Chris Cole

Post by Randy Yates

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers
to 'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present
*your* thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid. HTH Chris.

Chris,
I think that's a very heavy-handed comment. If you're not interested,
simply don't respond. I think it's reasonable to ask the folks here for
such help. Of course many people won't have the time, but some might.

Randy,
I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested). However,
the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected people with a
high level of technical expertise to donate their free (not as in free
beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond what I consider
reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and phrasing problems'. He
doesn't need technical expertise, just a native English speaker.
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

But take into account that he isn't a native english speaker (as you
will easily recognize when you have a short look at the text), so he
might not be aware of these nuances.

But what I would recommend to Benoit-Pierre is to use at least a spell-
checker before asking other people to read it - already the first few
pages contain several typos that a spellchecker would easily find (use
e.g. emacs in TeX mode to stop the spellchecker from complaining about
the TeX tags). Another thing is your frequent use of sentences using
"I", which makes it look more like a blog than a scientific text. E.g.
in the very first sentences of the chapter you call "Global descrip-
tion" (copied verbally)

"In endebbed and limited systems, I want the computing time to be
constant, and the error ratio to be the same for each computation.
The use of random search may increase slightly the speed of the
process, but since that can introduce big variations of error
ratio, I don't want to use it."

you would prefer to replace the "I want" with "it is preferable"
or something like that. Beside that you should try to re-read these
sentences, trying to pretend that you don't know anything about the
topic. Then you probably will find that hardly anyone will under-
stand what you mean by "computing time to be constant" since you
don't even tell what you are computing. The same holds for the
discussion of the error ratio - what kind of errors in what compu-
tations are you talking about and what do you compare them to to be
able to calculate a ratio? And how comes a "random search" into it?
Is having the "same error ratio" restricted to embedded (and not
"endebbed" as you consistently spell it) and limited (whatever that
are supposed to be) systems?
Regards, Jens

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
But take into account that he isn't a native english speaker (as you
will easily recognize when you have a short look at the text), so he
might not be aware of these nuances.

I thought I was aware of the nuance, but I did not think you would take
it as agressive form ...

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
But what I would recommend to Benoit-Pierre is to use at least a spell-
checker before asking other people to read it

I run the spell checker tvice a day on this document ...

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
Another thing is your frequent use of sentences using
"I", which makes it look more like a blog than a scientific text. E.g.

There is an historical reason : I wrote first the logbook, which you
could call a blog. For this project I am used to speak in my own name.
But this reflexion will be take into consideration during further
re-reading.

[Grant Edwards]

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
But take into account that he isn't a native english speaker (as you
will easily recognize when you have a short look at the text), so he
might not be aware of these nuances.

I thought I was aware of the nuance, but I did not think you would take
it as agressive form ...

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
But what I would recommend to Benoit-Pierre is to use at least a spell-
checker before asking other people to read it

I run the spell checker tvice a day on this document ...

At first I thought that statement was a joke. ;)

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
Another thing is your frequent use of sentences using
"I", which makes it look more like a blog than a scientific text. E.g.

There is an historical reason : I wrote first the logbook, which you
could call a blog. For this project I am used to speak in my own name.
But this reflexion will be take into consideration during further
re-reading.

For whatever the reason, it's traditional to use passive voice
in scientific/technical academic writing. Sometime's it's a
bit awkward, but that's how it's done.

[axlq]

Post by Grant Edwards

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
Another thing is your frequent use of sentences using
"I", which makes it look more like a blog than a scientific text. E.g.

There is an historical reason : I wrote first the logbook, which you
could call a blog. For this project I am used to speak in my own name.

For whatever the reason, it's traditional to use passive voice
in scientific/technical academic writing. Sometime's it's a
bit awkward, but that's how it's done.

Nonsense! It's only "traditional" and "how it's done" because many
technical people don't know how to write well, and/or are too lazy
to write well, and/or don't know any better.

This is a pet peeve of mine. I routinely see technical papers
filled with passive voice (i.e. boring) sentences that COULD have
been written better in active voice (i.e. interesting, attention
grabbing) WITHOUT resorting to the personal pronoun "I". Take this
exerpt from the OP's paper:

"In endebbed and limited systems, I want the computing time to be
constant, and the error ratio to be the same for each computation.
The use of random search may increase slightly the speed of the
process, but since that can introduce big variations of error
ratio, I don't want to use it."

Someone else suggested substituting "it is desrible for..." for "I
want...." I disagree. That makes the sentence boring. I suggest:

In embedded and limited systems, the computing time should
stay constant, and the error ratio should not change in each
computation. A random search may increase slightly the speed of
the process; however, this gain occurs at the expense of large
variations in error ratio.

Even substituting "we" is acceptable in technical papers. I see it
often, and I like it because it allows one to communicate in active
voice without using "I":

In embedded and limited systems, we desire consistency in
computing time and error ratio in each computation. We avoid
random searches because the slight gain in speed fails to
compensate for the resultant large variation in error ratio.

-Alex

[Grant Edwards]

Post by axlq

Post by Grant Edwards

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by J***@physik.fu-berlin.de
Another thing is your frequent use of sentences using
"I", which makes it look more like a blog than a scientific text. E.g.

There is an historical reason : I wrote first the logbook, which you
could call a blog. For this project I am used to speak in my own name.

For whatever the reason, it's traditional to use passive voice
in scientific/technical academic writing. Sometime's it's a
bit awkward, but that's how it's done.

Nonsense!

So you're claiming it's not traditional to use active voice?
You must read different journals and attend different schools
than I.

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

| In embedded and limited systems, the computing time should
| stay constant, and the error ratio should not change in each
| computation. A random search may increase slightly the speed of
| the process; however, this gain occurs at the expense of large
| variations in error ratio.

I desegree with you : the phrasing
"the computing time should stay constant"
means that I put authority to claim it is right, what is not my aim. I
am not experienced enough to claim that what _I_ think _is_ right !!!

That is why I dont want to use that kind of phrasing. It could make the
reader think that what I write /is/ the only truth ... whereas I expect
many parts of my report to be, in worse case, wrong, or at least
possibly not the only solution ...

- --
DEMAINE Benoît-Pierre http:/www.demaine.info/
\_o< apt-get remove ispell >o_/
There're 10 types of people: those who can count in binary and those who
can't

[axlq]

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre
| In embedded and limited systems, the computing time should
| stay constant, and the error ratio should not change in each
| computation. A random search may increase slightly the speed of
| the process; however, this gain occurs at the expense of large
| variations in error ratio.
I desegree with you : the phrasing
"the computing time should stay constant"
means that I put authority to claim it is right, what is not my aim. I
am not experienced enough to claim that what _I_ think _is_ right !!!

I don't think my phrasing does that. Saying "the computing time
MUST stay constant" carries more authority than "the computing time
SHOULD stay constant." But if that's still too strong, make it
"We prefer the computing time to stay constant" if you like. All
of those are active-voice sentences that avoid using the personal
pronoun "I" which makes it sound like a blog.

My point was, writing in the active voice makes your message
clearer, having more impact on the reader. I made no claim to know
what you were writing about, I went strictly by the English I read,
and suggested ways to improve it, without knowing the intent behind
what you wrote.

I hope you liked the second sentence in my suggested changed
paragraph better.

-Alex

[Roger Willcocks]

Post by axlq
Even substituting "we" is acceptable in technical papers. I see it
often, and I like it because it allows one to communicate in active
In embedded and limited systems, we desire consistency in
computing time and error ratio in each computation. We avoid
random searches because the slight gain in speed fails to
compensate for the resultant large variation in error ratio.

FWIW that's how we were taught to write when I was an undergraduate in 1980
or so. It was always a slight puzzle to me who 'we' might be, since I was
working alone. But most academic papers are, of course, group efforts.

Post by axlq
-Alex

--
Roger

[Programmer Dude]

Post by Roger Willcocks
FWIW that's how we were taught to write when I was an undergraduate in 1980
or so. It was always a slight puzzle to me who 'we' might be, since I was
working alone.

It's the "editorial 'we'".

[Kevin D. Quitt]

Post by Programmer Dude

Post by Roger Willcocks
FWIW that's how we were taught to write when I was an undergraduate in 1980
or so. It was always a slight puzzle to me who 'we' might be, since I was
working alone.

It's the "editorial 'we'".

Nowadays, it really *could* be a mouse in your pocket.

[axlq]

Post by Roger Willcocks

Post by axlq
Even substituting "we" is acceptable in technical papers. I see it
often, and I like it because it allows one to communicate in active
In embedded and limited systems, we desire consistency in
computing time and error ratio in each computation. We avoid
random searches because the slight gain in speed fails to
compensate for the resultant large variation in error ratio.

FWIW that's how we were taught to write when I was an undergraduate in 1980
or so. It was always a slight puzzle to me who 'we' might be, since I was
working alone. But most academic papers are, of course, group efforts.

I always assumed "we" meant the author and the reader. A statement
like "we wish to prevent an explosion of the experiment container so
that it can be re-used" presupposes, as a premise, that "we" (all of
"us," the author and readers) agree on this point, for the purpose
of moving on with the article.

-A

[Julian Bradfield]

Post by Grant Edwards
For whatever the reason, it's traditional to use passive voice
in scientific/technical academic writing. Sometime's it's a
bit awkward, but that's how it's done.

This statement is too broad. In some areas, third person passive
is considered a defunct tradition. Maths and Computer Science often
write in the active. The American Chemical Society recommends first
person active; the American Psychological Association third person
passive.

[Jerry Avins]

Grant Edwards wrote:

...

Post by Grant Edwards
For whatever the reason, it's traditional to use passive voice
in scientific/technical academic writing. Sometime's it's a
bit awkward, but that's how it's done.

That's so, but we should applaud those who buck the trend in favor of
directness.

Jerry

[Steve Underwood]

Post by Jerry Avins
...

Post by Grant Edwards
For whatever the reason, it's traditional to use passive voice
in scientific/technical academic writing. Sometime's it's a
bit awkward, but that's how it's done.

That's so, but we should applaud those who buck the trend in favor of
directness.
Jerry

I agree. the passive voice always sounds like the author is trying to
avoid taking responsibility for what they are writing.

Steve

[Jerry Avins]

Post by Chris Cole
Randy,
I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested). However,
the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected people with a
high level of technical expertise to donate their free (not as in free
beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond what I consider
reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and phrasing problems'. He
doesn't need technical expertise, just a native English speaker.
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That choice of words simply shows that he's not a native English
speaker. A friend thought she was saying "I don't care" in French, but
what she actually said was closer to "I don't give a good God damn."

Post by Chris Cole
Remember, a thesis is supposed to be all your *own* work. Surely, he could
have got a friend or someone in the University dept. to have a look, esp.
as he's not specifically after technical pointers. Also, I don't
understand why he wants us to see before his supervisor.

It's really stupid to assume that what's cross posted remains a secret.
He may not care.

Post by Chris Cole
It's just as much
in his interest that you pass as it is yours, it's part of his supervisory
role to check the final report/thesis.

I don't grok the pronouns there.

Post by Chris Cole
My comments may have been harsh, but I feel fair.

Fair? Yes. Necessary? You decide. Benoit-Pierre probably learned from
it. (I'm not going to proofread it either.)

Jerry

[Tim Wescott]

Post by Jerry Avins

Post by Chris Cole
Randy,
I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested). However,
the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected people with a
high level of technical expertise to donate their free (not as in free
beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond what I consider
reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and phrasing problems'. He
doesn't need technical expertise, just a native English speaker.
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That choice of words simply shows that he's not a native English
speaker. A friend thought she was saying "I don't care" in French, but
what she actually said was closer to "I don't give a good God damn."

There's a difference in English? That explains why I keep pissing off
managers!

Post by Jerry Avins

Post by Chris Cole
Remember, a thesis is supposed to be all your *own* work. Surely, he could
have got a friend or someone in the University dept. to have a look, esp.
as he's not specifically after technical pointers. Also, I don't
understand why he wants us to see before his supervisor.

It's really stupid to assume that what's cross posted remains a secret.
He may not care.

I don't understand wanting it done before he shows his supervisor, but I
see nothing wrong with having someone go over it -- particularly for
grammar, punctuation & usage. Even having somebody go over it for
technical problems is well within what I would find acceptable.

If it were me I wouldn't post it here though -- I'd pay an English major
to vet it.

Post by Jerry Avins

Post by Chris Cole
It's just as much
in his interest that you pass as it is yours, it's part of his supervisory
role to check the final report/thesis.

I don't grok the pronouns there.

Post by Chris Cole
My comments may have been harsh, but I feel fair.

Fair? Yes. Necessary? You decide. Benoit-Pierre probably learned from
it. (I'm not going to proofread it either.)
Jerry

[Chris Cole]

Post by Jerry Avins

Post by Chris Cole
Randy,
I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested).
However, the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected
people with a high level of technical expertise to donate their free
(not as in free beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond
what I consider reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and
phrasing problems'. He doesn't need technical expertise, just a native
English speaker.
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That choice of words simply shows that he's not a native English
speaker. A friend thought she was saying "I don't care" in French, but
what she actually said was closer to "I don't give a good God damn."

Sorry, but that doesn't wash with me. The OP's doing a Masters degree at
an English University, so he should have more than a simple grasp of the
English language. Politeness is not a language issue. BTW I'm pretty
fluent in French and if I were to a make a similar request on a French ng
I'd make damn sure that the tone was correct. I'm guessing your friend was
confusing 'je m'en fiche' (I do not care) with 'je m'en fou' (I don't give
a f***), which indeed say the same, but with considerable difference in
strength ;-)

[Jerry Avins]

Post by Chris Cole

Post by Jerry Avins

Post by Chris Cole
Randy,
I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested).
However, the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected
people with a high level of technical expertise to donate their free
(not as in free beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond
what I consider reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and
phrasing problems'. He doesn't need technical expertise, just a native
English speaker.
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

That choice of words simply shows that he's not a native English
speaker. A friend thought she was saying "I don't care" in French, but
what she actually said was closer to "I don't give a good God damn."

Sorry, but that doesn't wash with me. The OP's doing a Masters degree at
an English University, so he should have more than a simple grasp of the
English language. Politeness is not a language issue. BTW I'm pretty
fluent in French and if I were to a make a similar request on a French ng
I'd make damn sure that the tone was correct. I'm guessing your friend was
confusing 'je m'en fiche' (I do not care) with 'je m'en fou' (I don't give
a f***), which indeed say the same, but with considerable difference in
strength ;-)

English university? I missed that. Write him off!

The friend (still!), a high-school classmate, had just finished her
junior year and was visiting in France for the summer. Very
embarrassing, especially at that age.

Jerry

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

Post by Chris Cole
Sorry, but that doesn't wash with me. The OP's doing a Masters degree at
an English University, so he should have more than a simple grasp of the
English language. Politeness is not a language issue. BTW I'm pretty

You would be surprised to see how easy it was to enter this university;
and I can sware you that many students can get their degree and go back
home after a year not even knowing how to ask their way in town ( in
english ).

[Chris Cole]

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by Chris Cole
Sorry, but that doesn't wash with me. The OP's doing a Masters degree at
an English University, so he should have more than a simple grasp of the
English language. Politeness is not a language issue. BTW I'm pretty

You would be surprised to see how easy it was to enter this university;
and I can sware you that many students can get their degree and go back
home after a year not even knowing how to ask their way in town ( in
english ).

Well that speaks volumes about Staffordshire University and the value of
degrees they award. TBH I'd not even heard of the place and I only live an
hour away.

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

Post by Jerry Avins
It's really stupid to assume that what's cross posted remains a secret.
He may not care.

I dont see your point at all. Is a final year report expected to be a
secret ? It is before all a university research ... the aim of my work
is to improove my computing knowledge, and that every one should benefit
of my work. Any way, the university will double publish it: once in
their own library, once in the national library in London. This is why I
am looking for rereaders.

[Chris Cole]

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by Jerry Avins
It's really stupid to assume that what's cross posted remains a secret.
He may not care.

I dont see your point at all. Is a final year report expected to be a
secret ? It is before all a university research ... the aim of my work
is to improove my computing knowledge, and that every one should benefit
of my work. Any way, the university will double publish it: once in
their own library, once in the national library in London. This is why I
am looking for rereaders.

Where no-one will read it! I'm sorry, but it's true. PhD and Masters
theses are very rarely read by anyone outside of the dept. where you did
the work. If there's anything of value in a thesis it should be published
in a peer-reviewed journal which has much more (inter)national clout in
terms of reliability of quality of findings.

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

Post by Chris Cole
I almost did ignore it (as I usually do when I'm not interested). However,
the fact the OP cross-posted to seven ngs *and* expected people with a
high level of technical expertise to donate their free (not as in free
beer!) time to read a 73 page thesis was far beyond what I consider
reasonable. Especially as he's after 'syntax and phrasing problems'. He
doesn't need technical expertise, just a native English speaker.

None of my friend has sufficient english level to read my thesis.
And my tutor wants my report to be corrected before I submit it.

Post by Chris Cole
The tone is wrong as well. Words like 'expect' and 'shall' are not
synonymous with a request, more an order.

Sorry for that. I dont want to force any one.

Post by Chris Cole
Remember, a thesis is supposed to be all your *own* work. Surely, he could
have got a friend or someone in the University dept. to have a look, esp.
as he's not specifically after technical pointers. Also, I don't
understand why he wants us to see before his supervisor. It's just as much
in his interest that you pass as it is yours, it's part of his supervisory
role to check the final report/thesis.
My comments may have been harsh, but I feel fair.

In fact, I dont feel confident with my tutor.

[Babacio]

DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre.

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by Chris Cole
Remember, a thesis is supposed to be all your *own* work. Surely, he could
have got a friend or someone in the University dept. to have a look, esp.
as he's not specifically after technical pointers. Also, I don't
understand why he wants us to see before his supervisor. It's just as much
in his interest that you pass as it is yours, it's part of his supervisory
role to check the final report/thesis.
My comments may have been harsh, but I feel fair.

In fact, I dont feel confident with my tutor.

Qui se dévoue pour forwarder ça à l'intéressé ?

[A Nengineer]

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers to
'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present *your*
thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid.
HTH
Chris.

Um, did he ask you to comment on his request? Nevertheless, you did,
didn't you?

And you did it by CHOICE, didn't you?

Wow, maybe we're getting close to an answer to your question, aren't we?

That is, he's making a request, and you can IGNORE his request, or you
can CHOOSE to help him out. Either way, no one's forcing you to do
anything--hell, you didn't even HAVE to read his post!

People like you are amazing to behold, Mr. Scrooge. You won't go out of
your way to help--that's your choice--but you don't mind taking a little
time to sling shit.

Thanks for breathing.

[Rick Lyons]

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers to
'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present *your*
thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid.
HTH
Chris.

Ha ha.

I agree with you. The "favor" the guy was asking
is equivalent to asking someone to come to your
house and install a new roof. And oh by the way,
"I'm in a hurry" to have this done.

This reminds me of an E-mail I received from a guy
in China. He said he liked the articles in my
"DSP Tips & Tricks" column of the IEEE Signal
Processing magazine. Then he asked me to send
him an electronic copy of all the articles
ever published in the column!

Now "that takes nerve", as we say.

Ha ha.
[-Rick-]

[Rufus V. Smith]

Post by Rick Lyons

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers to
'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present *your*
thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid.
HTH
Chris.

Ha ha.
I agree with you. The "favor" the guy was asking
is equivalent to asking someone to come to your
house and install a new roof. And oh by the way,
"I'm in a hurry" to have this done.
This reminds me of an E-mail I received from a guy
in China. He said he liked the articles in my
"DSP Tips & Tricks" column of the IEEE Signal
Processing magazine. Then he asked me to send
him an electronic copy of all the articles
ever published in the column!
Now "that takes nerve", as we say.
Ha ha.
[-Rick-]

Does every word out of your mouths or every key pressed
come with a click charge? Jeez. you guys!

There really are some people who genuinely enjoy helping other
people out, without need for reward other than the mental exercise
or ego boost.

Perhaps there are people who, in the process of critiquing the thesis,
would get information out of it applicable to their own work. I started
to read it with this in mind but was put off immediately by the spelling and
grammar errors in the first few paragraphs. Anyone writing a thesis
should be able to run a quick spell check. But that's not the point.

The only valid complaints might be the tenor of the requests, which
perhaps did sound arrogant and demanding, but that could be a cultural
difference or a simple error in translation.

And Rick, so what if someone asked for an electronic copy of "Tips
and Tricks"??? As far as anyone knows, that could be a mouse
click (or two) away for you! That would not be too much to ask, would it?

Lighten Up, Fellas!

Rufus

[Rick Lyons]

On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 11:17:08 -0500, "Rufus V. Smith"

Post by Chris Cole

Post by Rick Lyons

Post by Chris Cole
<snip freeloader>
And why exactly do you feel it's reasonable to ask complete strangers to
'mark' your work? What recompense do we get for helping you present

*your*

Post by Rick Lyons

Post by Chris Cole
thesis? You're either very arrogant or very stupid.
HTH
Chris.

Ha ha.
I agree with you. The "favor" the guy was asking
is equivalent to asking someone to come to your
house and install a new roof. And oh by the way,
"I'm in a hurry" to have this done.
This reminds me of an E-mail I received from a guy
in China. He said he liked the articles in my
"DSP Tips & Tricks" column of the IEEE Signal
Processing magazine. Then he asked me to send
him an electronic copy of all the articles
ever published in the column!
Now "that takes nerve", as we say.
Ha ha.
[-Rick-]

Hi Rufus,

I enjoyed your thoughtful post.

Post by Chris Cole
Does every word out of your mouths or every key pressed
come with a click charge? Jeez. you guys!

Darn, I've never heard that phrase "click charge"
before so I'm not rightly sure of its true meaning.
I'm guessing that you're implying that the
"you guys" (which includes me) are not often
willing to help upon request.

This newsgroup, I believe, is the most helpful
group of guys I've ever encountered. Of course that's
just my opinion.

Post by Chris Cole
There really are some people who genuinely enjoy helping other
people out, without need for reward other than the mental exercise
or ego boost.

You bet. And I do try to be one of those "people."
But it's not always so pleasant. A guy once asked me to review
a manuscript for an article he was gonna submit to the
Embedded System's Programming magazine. I spent two hours
going through his material making corrections and providing
suggestions on how he might make the material more clear and
readable. I even created a few drawings for him that I thought
would improve the information content of his article.
Upon sending him my review comments/suggestions, he didn't
reply to thank me. A week later I e-mailed him and asked if he'd
received my comments. That was his opportunity to thank me
for my efforts, but the jerk never did. Can ya' imagine?

Some years ago I received a request for a PDF file of a
quadrature processing tutorial article that I had written.
I sent the guy the PDF, only to learn some months later that
he stole four figures from my article and pasted them
in his company report that he had written. His report did
*NOT* acknowledge me as the source of those figures.
That is clearly dishonest.

A couple of years ago mechanical engineering instructor
E-mailed me requesting electronic files of several figures
from my DSP book. He wanted to use them in his training
class he conducts for the Applied Technology Institute.
I told him he'd have to contact my publisher because the
publisher owns those figures, not me. He got back to me
complaining that the publisher wanted over $100 to allow him to
use the figures he desired. So what did knucklehead Rick do?
I took the time to redraw those figures maintaining their
information content, but making them look different enough
so as not to commit a copyright violation. After sending
the files for the new figures to the instructor, I never
heard from this ill-mannered clown again. No he did not
die--he's still teaching his class.

Post by Chris Cole
Perhaps there are people who, in the process of critiquing the thesis,
would get information out of it applicable to their own work. I started
to read it with this in mind but was put off immediately by the spelling and
grammar errors in the first few paragraphs. Anyone writing a thesis
should be able to run a quick spell check. But that's not the point.

Ha. I too started to read his material but after the
first page I experienced blurred vision, and began
suffering from severe abdominal pain. I had to stop reading.

Post by Chris Cole
The only valid complaints might be the tenor of the requests, which
perhaps did sound arrogant and demanding, but that could be a cultural
difference or a simple error in translation.

"Cultural difference" or not, every culture has the words
"please" and "thank you", don't they? Although I wasn't
offended by his post. (I wonder if he's read this thread?)

Post by Chris Cole
And Rick, so what if someone asked for an electronic copy of "Tips
and Tricks"??? As far as anyone knows, that could be a mouse
click (or two) away for you! That would not be too much to ask, would it?

Well, now whoa. Wait a minute! Four things:

(1) That guy should have asked, "Rick, how can I get
copies of all the Tips&Tricks articles?" He should have
made some small effort, himself, in solving his problem.

(2) "... a mouse click (or two) away"! No way!
I don't have electronic copies of all the Tips&Tricks
articles published over the last two years.
I don't know who would, except maybe in the
archives of the Typesetting people who work for the
IEEE. My copies of those articles are the
printed magazine issues themselves.

(3) My sending electronic copies of any material whose
copyright is owned by the IEEE is dishonest at best,
and probably illegal.

(4) I do have electronic copies of the articles I wrote but
I've suffered so much with stinkin' rats plagiarizing
my work, over the years, that I'm now super "gun shy" about
supplying electronic versions of my work to anyone. So
being the paranoid, suspicious, guy that I am I thought,
if this guy has read some of the Tips&Tricks articles then
he must have access to issues of the printed magazine.
Then I asked myself, "Why, in the name of Sweet Merciful
Jesus, would he want electronic copies of the articles?"
I'll let you answer that question.

Post by Chris Cole
Lighten Up, Fellas!

Ha ha. If I was any lighter, I'd float away.

Post by Chris Cole
Rufus

Again Rufus, I enjoyed your post. Thanks.
Merry Christmas.
[-Rick-]

[Babacio]

(Rick Lyons).

Hi Rick,

Post by Rick Lyons
This newsgroup, I believe, is the most helpful
group of guys I've ever encountered.

Uh oh ; which newsgroup are you speaking of right now ? This message
is posted in... oh, I think I can count 7 newsgroups. I feel sure the
thread started with 8 of them.

Post by Rick Lyons
"Cultural difference" or not, every culture has the words
"please" and "thank you", don't they? Although I wasn't
offended by his post.

You bet.

Please, would you exclude the group fr.sci.maths from future
crossposting in this thread ? The fr.* hierarchy is french
speaking. Thank you in advance!

I have been asking this several times this last days. I subscribed
temporarily to one of the english speaking groups in the list, namely
comp.dsp, to be able to read answers to this request.

Post by Rick Lyons
(I wonder if he's read this thread?)

I did, and I enjoyed a lot the humour of some messages. But that's not
my point right now..,

[Rufus V. Smith]

Post by Rick Lyons
On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 11:17:08 -0500, "Rufus V. Smith"
Hi Rufus,
I enjoyed your thoughtful post.

Post by Rufus V. Smith
Does every word out of your mouths or every key pressed
come with a click charge? Jeez. you guys!

Darn, I've never heard that phrase "click charge"
before so I'm not rightly sure of its true meaning.

It comes from working on mailroom equipment in a prior
life where the high-speed xerox printers had a "click" charge
for each sheet or image printed, in addition to regular
maintenance agreements.

Post by Rick Lyons
I'm guessing that you're implying that the
"you guys" (which includes me) are not often
willing to help upon request.

It was directed at you and Chris, but also broader, to that
class of people who won't talk to you until you supply a
credit card number. A group I don't believe you belong to
now.

Post by Rick Lyons

Post by Rufus V. Smith
There really are some people who genuinely enjoy helping other
people out, without need for reward other than the mental exercise
or ego boost.

You bet. And I do try to be one of those "people."
But it's not always so pleasant...
A guy once asked me to review
a manuscript for an article he was gonna submit...

...

Post by Rick Lyons
Upon sending him my review comments/suggestions, he didn't
reply to thank me. A week later I e-mailed him and asked if he'd
received my comments. That was his opportunity to thank me
for my efforts, but the jerk never did. Can ya' imagine?

< additional examples snipped >

People who don't give proper attribution, or even minimal
gratitude, should be slapped. At least.

Post by Rick Lyons

Post by Rufus V. Smith
And Rick, so what if someone asked for an electronic copy of "Tips
and Tricks"??? As far as anyone knows, that could be a mouse
click (or two) away for you! That would not be too much to ask, would it?

< (1)impertinence of request, (2) availability of materials,
(3) legal issues, (4) dubious intent snipped>

The request was certainly impertinent. I could see that even if you had
a "url" or isbn #, that you might be disinclined to provide it at that
point.

(I have the occasional scar from being helpful, too. Now I
appreciate your position better)

Post by Rick Lyons

Post by Rufus V. Smith
Rufus

Again Rufus, I enjoyed your post. Thanks.
Merry Christmas.
[-Rick-]

Merry Christmas to you too Rick.

(and all other lurkers enjoy your holidays, whatever they may be)

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

It looks like many people mis-understood me:

- - if I knew my english to be perfect, I would not ask for help.

- - the subject I choosed for this thread is not: "hey guys I ve done a
great work, you should read this", but "I need some heavy help, who has
time to afford me ?"

- - I dont want to force any one, but if any one really want to help me,
then I tell by advance which kind of help I want. That is why I wrote :
"Readers shall/are expected to" ... if you dont want to be a reader it
is up to you.

- - I very shortly describe my thesis in the post so that if the topic
bores any one, he can forget me; but if is interesed, it is up to him to
read it all ( or part ).

Is that fair ?

- --
DEMAINE Benoît-Pierre http:/www.demaine.info/
\_o< apt-get remove ispell >o_/
There're 10 types of people: those who can count in binary and those who
can't

[FLY135]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
- - if I knew my english to be perfect, I would not ask for help.
- - the subject I choosed for this thread is not: "hey guys I ve done a
great work, you should read this", but "I need some heavy help, who has
time to afford me ?"
- - I dont want to force any one, but if any one really want to help me,
"Readers shall/are expected to" ... if you dont want to be a reader it
is up to you.
- - I very shortly describe my thesis in the post so that if the topic
bores any one, he can forget me; but if is interesed, it is up to him to
read it all ( or part ).
Is that fair ?

It appears that they don't want to help anyway. Your post read like an RFP
"Request For Proposal" instead of a request for help. No big deal, but you
apparently got the hens off their eggs and made them start cackling. Not
only that but after admonishing you for spamming, they set about to spam
with a debate over how much skill in English you should of had.

The whole thing is quite funny really.

[Richard Dobson]

Post by FLY135
Not
only that but after admonishing you for spamming, they set about to spam
with a debate over how much skill in English you should of had.
The whole thing is quite funny really.

I just have to ask if this is deliberate: it is the first time I have seen
"should of" in any public newsgroup; and of course it's doubly funny in a thread
about good English!

Richard Dobson

[Richard Dobson]

Post by FLY135
Not
only that but after admonishing you for spamming, they set about to spam
with a debate over how much skill in English you should of had.
The whole thing is quite funny really.

I just have to ask if this is deliberate: it is the first time I have seen
"should of" in any public newsgroup; and of course it's doubly funny in a thread
about good English!

Richard Dobson

[FLY135]

Post by Richard Dobson

Post by FLY135
Not
only that but after admonishing you for spamming, they set about to spam
with a debate over how much skill in English you should of had.
The whole thing is quite funny really.

I just have to ask if this is deliberate: it is the first time I have seen
"should of" in any public newsgroup; and of course it's doubly funny in a thread
about good English!
Richard Dobson

If you double post it to alt.grammer you might be able to start a good
discussion.

[Babacio]

"FLY135"

Post by FLY135
If you double post it to alt.grammer you might be able to start a good
discussion.

By the way, I'd like to ask all the contributors of this thread to
stop posting in fr.sci.maths, which is a french speaking group.

I suppressed it from the list of recipients for this post; I subscribe
temporarily to comp.dsp so that I'll be able to read your answers, if
some.

Thank you in advance.

[Tim Wescott]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
- - if I knew my english to be perfect, I would not ask for help.
- - the subject I choosed for this thread is not: "hey guys I ve done a
great work, you should read this", but "I need some heavy help, who has
time to afford me ?"
- - I dont want to force any one, but if any one really want to help me,
"Readers shall/are expected to" ... if you dont want to be a reader it
is up to you.
- - I very shortly describe my thesis in the post so that if the topic
bores any one, he can forget me; but if is interesed, it is up to him to
read it all ( or part ).
Is that fair ?

I still think you should get an english major to look at it.
Preferrably a really good looking one in your preference of gender.
Reward him/her by taking him/her out to dinner -- perhaps oysters with
lots and lots of wine. Then suggest that you need to go back to your
room to take another look. Then discover that you just happen to have
some champaign stashed away.

The rest is up to you, but remember: a good engineer kills two birds
with one stone.

[axlq]

Post by Tim Wescott
I still think you should get an english major to look at it.
Preferrably a really good looking one in your preference of gender.
Reward him/her by taking him/her out to dinner -- perhaps oysters with
lots and lots of wine. Then suggest that you need to go back to your
room to take another look. Then discover that you just happen to have
some champaign stashed away.
The rest is up to you, but remember: a good engineer kills two birds
with one stone.

That's the best suggestion I've seen in this thread!

Unfortunately it's not something I could have done when I was in
school. Others would come to me to proofread their stuff, since I
was known to be able to write well.

-A

[DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre]

I still think you should get an english major to look at it. Preferrably
a really good looking one in your preference of gender. Reward him/her
by taking him/her out to dinner -- perhaps oysters with lots and lots of
wine. Then suggest that you need to go back to your room to take
another look. Then discover that you just happen to have some champaign
stashed away.
The rest is up to you, but remember: a good engineer kills two birds
with one stone.

Your two peaces of advice are quiet interesting, but I definitively can
not follow any of them at the moment.

:)

[E. Charters]

Where you will get the most help...and I am sure you have thought
of this, is in a Canadian board, where Fr. speaking people who are
also fluently bilingual sympathize with your translational plight
and decide to take pity on you sufficient for their engagement in such
an ardous task as rewriting 70 pages of a document. This is a week's
work to get it write. (find the error in the last sentence)

comme ca -->

http://www.siliconinvestor.com/subject.aspx?subjectid=28756

Another idea is to get a chinese thesis advisor whose english is so
bad he won't notice the mistakes. It has worked for me.

EC<:-]

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by Tim Wescott
I still think you should get an english major to look at it.
Preferrably a really good looking one in your preference of gender.
Reward him/her by taking him/her out to dinner -- perhaps oysters with
lots and lots of wine. Then suggest that you need to go back to your
room to take another look. Then discover that you just happen to have
some champaign stashed away.
The rest is up to you, but remember: a good engineer kills two birds
with one stone.

Your two peaces of advice are quiet interesting, but I definitively can
not follow any of them at the moment.
:)

[E. Charters]

This will be really hard to correct. E.G."I expect some difficulties
about use of the clock" corrects to "I expect some difficulty [] with
use of the [] clock" It is easy to substitute, but is this correct? What
clock? You have a dangling reference. It is bad style, while
grammatically correct. Never assume that your thesis advisor knows a
grandfather clock from a MPU clock. [] must be filled in with
description or phrases that explain the terse phraseology.

"The last problem is to make everything work (chip+servos) only
consuming 500 MA as peak current."

One can see what you want to say.

"Finally the challenge is make the all components work, inclusive of
chips and servos, while only consuming a maximum of 500MA peak current."

Actually one does not consume peak current. One "reaches a level of
consumption that maximizes at [or does not exceed] a peak current of
500MA". The verb consume is active continuous in mood, whilst a peak
current usage is perforce transitory. Thus the meaning of the phrase is
corrupted.

The work of making this document correct and fluid is not trivial. Good
goddamned luck with it. It is not for amateurs.

EC<:-}

Post by DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

Post by Tim Wescott
I still think you should get an english major to look at it.
Preferrably a really good looking one in your preference of gender.
Reward him/her by taking him/her out to dinner -- perhaps oysters with
lots and lots of wine. Then suggest that you need to go back to your
room to take another look. Then discover that you just happen to have
some champaign stashed away.
The rest is up to you, but remember: a good engineer kills two birds
with one stone.

Your two peaces of advice are quiet interesting, but I definitively can
not follow any of them at the moment.
:)

[Stan Géant]

DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre wrote:

[snip]

Je me permets d'intervenir ici en tant qu'humble matheux (je lis ce
newsgroup (fr.sci.maths) avec intérêt, mais je crains de ne jamais y poster
vu mon pitoyable niveau) mais surtout en tant qu'habitué d'Usenet.

Vous avez eu droit à deux sortes de reproches : l'un concernait vos choix de
termes en anglais, et je me garderai bien d'y répondre), l'autre votre
méconnaissance du media Usenet et de ses règles. Je peux vous éclairer sur
le deuxième point.

Il est d'usage d'éviter les publications sur plusieurs groupes sans y mettre
un suivi-à (followup-to ou FU2) adapté. Le followup-to indiquant la
redirection de tous les messages en réponse vers un seul newsgroup, il
permet :
- de grouper toutes les réponses en un seul newsgroup ;
- d'éviter d'encombrer les autres newsgroups.
Poster un message sous 8 newsgroups, et qui plus est sans FU2, est considéré
comme un spam. Un fournisseur d'accès sérieux aurait d'ailleurs dû interdire
la diffusion de votre message.

Pour toutes vos questions sur Usenet et ses usages, voyez
news:fr.usenet.usages .

------------

[English version] Hi everybody. Nothing interesting here, just trying to
redirect the thread where it belongs...

[Rick Lyons]

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 21:09:35 +0000, DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
I have released the first full version of my thesis. I am looking for
rereaders to track syntax and phrasing problems.
The reader is expected to try to understand what I wrote, and report any
problem.

(snipped)

Like every one, I am in hurry; so please just mail me and tell me how
much time it will take to read it all.
PS : one part is still missing. It will say the same thing as the web
page, but in the PDF.
Many thanks for any help.
- --

Wow! You're asking for a favor that will take
hours and hours!

I suggest, first, you run a "Spellchecker" on
your text. A reader will forgive a misspelled word
now and then, but *not* twenty misspellings per page
is *VERY* unpleasant to read!

Next, and here's the hard part, you need someone
(called a "copy editor") to go through
your material and correct all the English grammar
mistakes. This effort will take 10-20 hours
(though I'm strictly guessing) because I'd say
60%-80% of your sentences require corrections, and
your thesis is roughly 70 pages.

Copy editors (usually) charge 25$-50$ per hour.
If you have a friend, maybe they'll "edit" your
material for free. But friends like that are
difficult to find.

Search the Internet for "copy editor hire".

Your idea to include photos in your thesis seems
like a good idea to me.

Good Luck,
[-Rick-]

[Kirk C Aune]

Post by Chris Cole
On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 21:09:35 +0000, DEMAINE Benoit-Pierre

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I have released the first full version of my thesis. I am looking for
rereaders to track syntax and phrasing problems.
The reader is expected to try to understand what I wrote, and report any
problem.

(snipped)

Like every one, I am in hurry; so please just mail me and tell me how
much time it will take to read it all.
PS : one part is still missing. It will say the same thing as the web
page, but in the PDF.
Many thanks for any help.
- --

Wow! You're asking for a favor that will take
hours and hours!
I suggest, first, you run a "Spellchecker" on
your text. A reader will forgive a misspelled word
now and then, but *not* twenty misspellings per page
is *VERY* unpleasant to read!
Next, and here's the hard part, you need someone
(called a "copy editor") to go through
your material and correct all the English grammar
mistakes. This effort will take 10-20 hours
(though I'm strictly guessing) because I'd say
60%-80% of your sentences require corrections, and
your thesis is roughly 70 pages.
Copy editors (usually) charge 25$-50$ per hour.
If you have a friend, maybe they'll "edit" your
material for free. But friends like that are
difficult to find.
Search the Internet for "copy editor hire".
Your idea to include photos in your thesis seems
like a good idea to me.
Good Luck,
[-Rick-]

All of this discussion skirts the one fundamental underpinning of what
most educators in the US assigns to academic theses, whether they be
Masters or PhD (most certainly PhD): This is to be a demonstration of
an ability to generate AND summarize original work. If you cannot do
both than you have not EARNED the degree to which you aspire. Edited
and or co-authoring work is for the publication in journals other than
dissertation abstracts.

[E. Charters]

You english syntax is somewhat laboured. I suggest having a technically
oriented English speaker rewrite the document. I would do it for 20
dollars per page, 50% payable in advance. No, I am not kidding. That is
dirt cheap. It could take up to an hour per page to make the language
comply with academic technical standards.

EC<:-}

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Hash: SHA1
I have released the first full version of my thesis. I am looking for
rereaders to track syntax and phrasing problems.
The reader is expected to try to understand what I wrote, and report any
problem.

In short. it deals with building a camera WHICH HAS THE CAPABILITY OF
TRACKING
any object. I had to build a USB development board based on the motorola
MC68HC908JB8,
write the monitor to upload the firmware under Linux, write the
firmware FOR THE MOTOROLA "PROCESSOR", write the user application THAT
PROCESSED THE
CAMERA INPUT, compute INTERPRETED MOVEMENT IN THE VIRTUAL FIELD
GENERATED BY THE INPUT,
and PRODUCE INSTRUCTIONS FOR the USB board to OPERATE the servo motors
ACTUATING the
camera.

# The above might sound a little stilted but colloquial language is not
allowed in a thesis.

EC<:-}